{"id":23,"date":"2012-01-14T16:31:36","date_gmt":"2012-01-14T06:31:36","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/2012\/01\/14\/santorum-does-reductio\/"},"modified":"2026-04-11T14:52:23","modified_gmt":"2026-04-11T14:52:23","slug":"santorum-does-reductio","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/2012\/01\/14\/santorum-does-reductio\/","title":{"rendered":"Santorum does Reductio"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><!-- [if gte mso 9]><xml>  <o:OfficeDocumentSettings>   <o:AllowPNG\/>  <\/o:OfficeDocumentSettings> <\/xml><![endif]--><!-- [if gte mso 9]><xml>  <w:WordDocument>   <w:View>Normal<\/w:View>   <w:Zoom>0<\/w:Zoom>   <w:TrackMoves\/>   <w:TrackFormatting\/>   <w:PunctuationKerning\/>   <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas\/>   <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false<\/w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>   <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false<\/w:IgnoreMixedContent>   <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false<\/w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>   <w:DoNotPromoteQF\/>   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Locked=\"false\" Priority=\"39\" QFormat=\"true\" Name=\"TOC Heading\"\/>  <\/w:LatentStyles> <\/xml><![endif]--><!-- [if gte mso 10]>\n\n\n\n<style>  \/* Style Definitions *\/  table.MsoNormalTable \t{mso-style-name:\"Table Normal\"; \tmso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; \tmso-tstyle-colband-size:0; \tmso-style-noshow:yes; \tmso-style-priority:99; \tmso-style-parent:\"\"; \tmso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; \tmso-para-margin-top:0cm; \tmso-para-margin-right:0cm; \tmso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; \tmso-para-margin-left:0cm; \tline-height:115%; \tmso-pagination:widow-orphan; \tfont-size:11.0pt; \tfont-family:\"Calibri\",\"sans-serif\"; \tmso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; \tmso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; \tmso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; \tmso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; \tmso-bidi-font-family:\"Times New Roman\"; \tmso-bidi-theme-font:minor-bidi;} table.MsoTableGrid \t{mso-style-name:\"Table Grid\"; \tmso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; \tmso-tstyle-colband-size:0; \tmso-style-priority:59; \tmso-style-unhide:no; \tborder:solid windowtext 1.0pt; \tmso-border-alt:solid windowtext .5pt; \tmso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; \tmso-border-insideh:.5pt solid windowtext; \tmso-border-insidev:.5pt solid windowtext; \tmso-para-margin:0cm; \tmso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; \tmso-pagination:widow-orphan; \tfont-size:11.0pt; \tfont-family:\"Calibri\",\"sans-serif\"; \tmso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; \tmso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; \tmso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; \tmso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; \tmso-bidi-font-family:\"Times New Roman\"; \tmso-bidi-theme-font:minor-bidi;} <\/style>\n\n <![endif]--><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">The recent incident, reported in the <\/span><a href=\"http:\/\/thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com\/2012\/01\/05\/santorum-gets-into-testy-debate-on-gay-marriage\/\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">New York Times<\/span><\/a><span lang=\"EN-AU\"> (Friday, January 13, 2012), of Rick Santorum trying to present an argument against same-sex \u2018marriage\u2019 to an audience of university students indicates that teaching the fundamentals of Critical Thinking remains an uphill struggle. Here\u2019s a partial transcript. I\u2019ve made adjustments for grammaticality and sense \u2013 actual speech looks like gibberish when written down \u2013 but I\u2019ve tried to be honest about the matter.<\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">Student: How about the idea that all men are created equal and have the right to happiness?<br \/>\nSantorum: Ok. So, are we saying that everyone should have the right to marry?<br \/>\n<\/span>Student(s): Yes.<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: Everyone?<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Students: Yes<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: <span lang=\"EN-AU\">So anyone can marry anybody else?<br \/>\n<\/span>Student(s): Yes.<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: So anybody can marry several people?<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Student(s): (Protests.)<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">&#8230;<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: So, everybody has the right to be happy, so if you\u2019re not happy unless you\u2019re married to five other people, is that ok?<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">&#8230;<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Student: I\u2019m not talking about that.<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: I\u2019m asking the question; if what you said was \u2018every person has a right to their own happiness \u2026\u2019<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Student(s): It\u2019s irrelevant.<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">(Protests.)<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: No it\u2019s not irrelevant.<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">\u2026<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Student: Is it right for two men to have the same rights as a man and a woman?<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: Well, what about three men?<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Student(s): I\u2019m not talking about that.<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">\u2026<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: I\u2019m going to ask you the question again. If it makes three people happy to get married, based on what you just said, what makes that wrong and what you said right?<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Student: How do you justify your belief based on your high morals you have about all men being created equal, when two men who want to get married \u2026 <\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: Well, what about three men?<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Student: That\u2019s not what I\u2019m talking about. <\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">\u2026<\/span><br \/>\n<span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum: You know, it\u2019s important if we\u2019re going to have a discussion based on rational thought, that we employ reason. And reason says that if you think it\u2019s ok for two, then you have to differentiate for me why it\u2019s not ok for three.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\">Santorum\u2019s point is a very (very) simple one, and, having tried to use the same sort of technique myself in arguments, I can sympathise with his frustration. It can sometimes feel like you&#8217;re talking to a brick wall in these situations.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">The student is clearly claiming that we have a right to marry whom we want because that is what we require for our happiness and we have a right to happiness.\u00a0 In standard form it\u2019s something like this:<\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">A1: The student\u2019s argument:<\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 P1.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 We have a right to happiness<br \/>\n<\/span><\/span><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0P2.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Two men may require to be married in order to achieve happiness<br \/>\n<\/span><\/span><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0HP1.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 [All things are rights that are necessary to achieve other rights.]<br \/>\n<\/span><\/span><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 &#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;-<\/span><\/span><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 C1.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Two men have a right to be married <\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">This can be taken as a valid argument. Santorum is attacking the idea that P1 and HP1 are true together. To do this, he grants for the sake of argument those two premisses and shows that it can lead, very plausibly, to an unacceptable conclusion.<\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 72pt; text-indent: -72pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">A2: Santorum\u2019s modification of the student\u2019s argument:<\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 P1.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 We have a right to happiness<br \/>\n<\/span><\/span><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0P3.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 <em>Three<\/em> men may require to be married in order to achieve happiness<br \/>\n<\/span><\/span><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a0HP1.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 [All things are rights that are necessary to achieve other rights.]<br \/>\n<\/span><\/span><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 &#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;-<\/span><\/span><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 C2.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Three men have a right to be married <\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">This is also a valid argument, but it leads to an unacceptable conclusion \u2013 which is to say, a conclusion that the proponents of A1 do not wish to admit (<\/span><a href=\"http:\/\/www.weeklystandard.com\/Content\/Public\/Articles\/000\/000\/006\/494pqobc.asp\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">at<\/span><\/a> <a href=\"http:\/\/www.heraldsun.com.au\/opinion\/we-thee-wed\/story-e6frfifx-1111112124331\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">this<\/span><\/a> <a href=\"http:\/\/www.theaustralian.com.au\/news\/features\/three-in-marriage-bed-more-of-a-good-thing\/story-e6frg6z6-1226218569577\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">time<\/span><\/a><span lang=\"EN-AU\">.) Since A2 is different from A1 only in substituting P3 for P2, and P2 and P3 are equally plausible possibilities, it follows that either P1 or HP1 are unacceptable. Since HP1 is left unstated, the focus of Santorum\u2019s counterargument is clearly P1. Santorum is arguing for no more than that you can\u2019t get a right to something because you say that it is necessary to your happiness. It\u2019s not even an argument <em>against<\/em> same sex \u2018marriage,\u2019 it\u2019s an argument against <em>that argument for<\/em> ssm.<\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\">Of course he could have inserted anything in the place of \u2018Two men require to be married,\u2019 and it might have made the point clearer than it already was if he had said \u2018I require to be king of the world\u2019 or \u2018I must be a single hat in a shop window\u2019 or \u2018I want to marry my daughter or my dog\u2019 (google that one.) But on the other hand, perhaps the crowd would just be even less able to see the connection.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\">What seems to be happening is that the audience are just not recognising that he is attacking the argument and not <em>directly<\/em> contradicting the conclusion<\/span>; they seem to expect him to offer an argument against same-sex \u2018marriage\u2019 as they had defined it which would look something like \u2018X and Y and Z, and therefore two men can\u2019t marry, and therefore you&#8217;re wrong.\u2019 Thus, whenever he proposed P3, and mentioned \u2018three men\u2019 they immediately reacted to that as if it was going off-topic. But it is hard to see how he could have made his strategy any plainer: <span lang=\"EN-AU\">as the NYT reported, he had previously, and consistently with previous outings, made the point that if they wish to change something, the onus is on them to present an argument in support of that change. (\u2018<\/span>Don\u2019t you have to make the positive argument why the law should be changed?\u201d he asked several of them.\u2019) Indeed, they react as if they had never before seen an argument challenged \u2013 but this is absurd: debates of any worth can\u2019t be conducted as independent arguments for different conclusions. You might as well not debate at all if you aren\u2019t going to address each other\u2019s arguments.<\/span><\/p>\n<p class=\"MsoNormal\" style=\"margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; text-indent: -1.1pt; line-height: normal;\"><span lang=\"EN-AU\"><span style=\"color: #000000;\">We know that people aren&#8217;t very good with arguments, and episodes such as this may perhaps be deplored as evidence of our fellow humans failure to live up to our own high standards, but a more useful reaction might be to take such episodes as indicators as to the kinds of rhetorical\/argumentative techniques that are appropriate to public speech. It&#8217;s no earthly use having a formally valid knock-down argument if none of your audience are capable of being persuaded by it. The whole point of argument is to give support to your point of view, and in so far as it fails to provide that support, it is a failure. Santorum&#8217;s argument is a failure everywhere outside the tiny fraction of the audience who are able to recognise through training or native ability its &#8216;formal&#8217; effectiveness.That tiny minority is not his intended audience.<\/span><\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>The recent incident, reported in the New York Times (Friday, January 13, 2012), of Rick Santorum trying to present an argument against same-sex \u2018marriage\u2019 to an audience of university students indicates that teaching the fundamentals of Critical Thinking remains an uphill struggle. Here\u2019s a partial transcript. I\u2019ve made adjustments for grammaticality and sense \u2013 actual [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[15],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-23","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-arguments"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/23","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=23"}],"version-history":[{"count":3,"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/23\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":725,"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/23\/revisions\/725"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=23"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=23"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/stevewatson.info\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=23"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}